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Ninj726 View Profile |
In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
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| 08/19/08 01:17am |
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Rocker3 View Profile |
Message To: Ninj726 In reference to Message Id: 1835801
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| 08/19/08 01:28am |
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Yexalen View Profile |
Message To: Rocker3 In reference to Message Id: 1835806 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
That is much much too small, even for one water dragon australian or chinese. four feet tall 4ft wide and 2 ft deep is absolute MINIMUM for ONE adult Bigger is always better Welcome to the site! Hope you stick around! Very beautiful dragons you got. Brumate is only recommended for breeding but i have NO experience with that topic. |
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| 08/19/08 01:32am |
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Cphill58 View Profile |
Message To: Yexalen In reference to Message Id: 1835807 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
If you are in calif...what part I am too...Rancho Cucamonga area ....I would wait in line for some off spring... It is the general consensous that brumating will give the female the greatest benifit ...allowing her to rest and not be constantly mated by the male ...the other idea behind that is to stop her egg production ...take her out of season ...thusly the male also ....But you may need to seperate them to do this sucessfully...especially due to your small set-up. If they are not sexually mature yet ...and they are not attempting to mate ...there is no reason to rest the female...therefore no brumation is needed. Once they do begin mating ...then you should consider it... How ever have you managed to keep them in this tank ??? you must tell me how long they have been in your possesion? Not to be rude , but I am assuming by your questions and lack of experience ...not long. If you need any help I woud be happy to assist ...I just hope I can earn some dragon points ...lol Buiatti is in Agentina ...his winter is now ...and he is brumating his pair/ they are sexually mature ....I will get a message to him to respond to this post.... Chris |
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| 08/19/08 02:40am |
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Ninj726 View Profile |
Message To: Cphill58 In reference to Message Id: 1835837 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
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| 08/19/08 02:58am |
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Mama42 View Profile |
Message To: Ninj726 In reference to Message Id: 1835845 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
actually, that setup is not the ideal size for a CWD. tallness is ideal. the height is more needed for them than the lenght or width. they are arboreal and need a lot of tall climbing stuff. i dont know that much about the Aussies. i always assumed they were the same regarding the care and setup an stuff... there are a few on here with them. Mr Greeeen, though AWOL atm, has 5 males in his setup. he has a hUGE outdoor atrium thing for them lol. you might contact him. i cant remember who else has them. oh..another person who has them is DragonDreams. she hasnt been on in a while, but does visit from time to time. good luck! |
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| 08/19/08 04:07am |
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4Kitara View Profile |
Message To: Mama42 In reference to Message Id: 1835857 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
One question I have. Do you have a lay box for your female???? It’s hard to picture one in such a small viv, what with the water bowl and hides as well, and it does look as though she MIGHT be gravid! If she is gravid and doesn’t have a suitable place to lay then she will not lay her eggs and will become eggbound, which can lead to death. Also keep in mind that a mature female will lay eggs whether being with a male or not, so just cause you haven’t seen any hanky panky, doesn’t mean she’s not gravid. Welcome!! And I truly hope we can help you out here!! |
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| 08/19/08 11:13am |
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Toxicneon View Profile |
Message To: Ninj726 In reference to Message Id: 1835845 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
Quote: I have had them in this setup for over a year now with absolutely no problems. Are you very familiar with Australian Water Dragons? They are a lot less prone to nose bouncing than their chinese counterparts, and can usually be housed in smaller areas because of this. It has been my general understanding that the large space requirements for Chinese Water dragons are also mainly due their nose bouncing tendencies.
This is not true. It is not just about nose bouncing, but about size. AWDs will grow larger and stockier than CWDs. They need to be housed in large enclosures, as the others have said. You should build up from the cage you have, if you don’t want to buy another tank. But they can’t stay in that tank. I house my 14 inch AWD in a 75 gallon, and he likes to rub his whole body against the sides. |
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| 08/19/08 11:15am |
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Rocker3 View Profile |
Message To: Toxicneon In reference to Message Id: 1835989
i just talk a lot. lol. |
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| 08/19/08 11:25am |
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J5dragon View Profile |
Message To: Toxicneon In reference to Message Id: 1835989 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
Ahh well AWD can grow larger than CWD’s, the only differences i know of is that AWD’s need higher temps, like 100. if you want to breed them you have to hibernate them indoors Your right, i believe you when you say they are less prone to nose rub because they can adapt to many extreme environments much better then CWD. They have been sighted jumping through floating trash in the Sydney rivers. I also remember reading some where that they prefer to be housed outside, this helps with breeding. I have a book which tells you how to make an outdoor enclosure for AWD’s. its called Water Dragons by bert langerwerf. but ya please make a larger viv |
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| 08/19/08 11:43am |
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Rocker3 View Profile |
Message To: J5dragon In reference to Message Id: 1836018
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| 08/19/08 11:56am |
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Ninj726 View Profile |
Message To: Rocker3 In reference to Message Id: 1836030 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
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| 08/19/08 02:07pm |
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Tarkah View Profile |
Message To: Rocker3 In reference to Message Id: 1836030 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
True they may be "fine" seem fine in the 60 gallon, but i’d be fine living in my closet. i wouldn’t like it but i mean what else can i do? The male likes to chase the female around and stuff but i don’t know how much chasing they can in a 4 feet long. i mean by now the male should be nearing 2-3 feet... Though they adapt better then the Asian counterparts they do need a larger enclosure because they do get bigger than CWD’s. Cloud got one, and Buiatti has some, Toxicneon has one or was it two?. all i can remember lol yah you need a laybox... Filled with damp soil, at LEAST 6" deep... and long and big enough for the female to turn around and sit comfortable in.. if she’s 2 feet thats at least a 2.5’ x 2.5’x 8inches box.... like a cat litter box... and i dont know how you’d fit one in a 60 gallon 
Are you giving her more calcium than usual? what uvb do you have? Gravid females need alot more calcium for egg developement. if not they either take the calcium from their bones, or they reabsorb the eggs. |
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| 08/19/08 02:11pm |
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Tarkah View Profile |
Message To: Tarkah In reference to Message Id: 1836131 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
There are alot of members here that can help you in preparing to breed them... In no way are we saying that you dont care or love your dragons as much as any of us. We are simply giving out suggestions that we think may help provide your dragons with the best and most comfortable life they can... |
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| 08/19/08 02:15pm |
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Ninj726 View Profile |
Message To: Tarkah In reference to Message Id: 1836131 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
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| 08/19/08 02:16pm |
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J5dragon View Profile |
Message To: Ninj726 In reference to Message Id: 1836126 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
No doubt you love your dragons, they look really healthy and plump haha. my book says, "In Sydney, February to July gets the most rainfall,...Breeding seems to be triggered only by a sufficiently long cool period in winter." (remember winter in Sydney is Feb to July) in my opinion, since this is only a seasonal change it should not have any affect on the growth of your dragons, and at two years old they are ready. again i dunno what your set up looks like, but if you don’t already have some "Eco Earth" for the female to dig and lay eggs, that may help stimulate breeding also. just my 2 cent. |
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| 08/19/08 02:22pm |
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Ninj726 View Profile |
Message To: J5dragon In reference to Message Id: 1836147 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
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| 08/19/08 04:45pm |
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J5dragon View Profile |
Message To: Ninj726 In reference to Message Id: 1836276 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
I think it would be best to plan ahead before breeding, you know like you will need another cage incubator ect...it’s kinda pricey. |
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| 08/19/08 05:11pm |
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Ninj726 View Profile |
Message To: J5dragon In reference to Message Id: 1836301 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
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| 08/19/08 05:17pm |
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Ninj726 View Profile |
Message To: J5dragon In reference to Message Id: 1836301 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
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| 08/19/08 05:19pm |
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J5dragon View Profile |
Message To: Ninj726 In reference to Message Id: 1836312 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
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| 08/19/08 05:26pm |
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Ninj726 View Profile |
Message To: J5dragon In reference to Message Id: 1836324 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
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| 08/19/08 05:27pm |
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Mama42 View Profile |
Message To: Ninj726 In reference to Message Id: 1836326 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
just wanted to make that point. it seems your not looking at all aspects of the situation. some of us may not know that much about Aussies (me), but some do know their stuff. ive been on here for 2 years and have learned quite a bit and would be willing to bet that they are right when they say they need a bigger enclosure. i would upgrade ASAP! |
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| 08/19/08 08:06pm |
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Cphill58 View Profile |
Message To: Mama42 In reference to Message Id: 1836549 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
As for your lizards diet ...may i suggest a more varied type....including super worms ( zophobas) and possibly small pinkies ....they are great sources of calcium and protein ....Meal worms are very much lacking as far as nutritious value ....they also have a hard exoskeleton , much more so than the super worms , and are more difficult to digest. Minnows , roaches , butter worms, earthworm, red worms , crickets and various insects can and will provide them with a varied and more protein filled diet. nice job on keeping them well so far ....I hope they continue to do well for you. As you said the male is always trying to copulate with the female with no success , does this indicate lack of sexual maturity ? I think it does , and if that is the case, pre mature behavior like this can be detrimental to the well being of the female. It would be wise to separate them for a season ....and then re introduce them when the possibility of maturity is greater. The male may always be trying and the harassment may be quite stressful for her. Let her develop and become fat and sassy to prepare for the rigors of mating and egg laying. If and when she does mate and become gravid , you will be prepared to separate them again and increase her calcium up take 2x fold to replace the calcium loss due to egg production. And you will be all set up too with a separate enclosure for her to lay and re- cooperate. My best to you ...again if you need any assistance or clients ...I would love to own some off spring Chris |
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| 08/24/08 03:33am |
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Clouddancer22 View Profile |
Message To: Cphill58 In reference to Message Id: 1840965 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
Quote: also, got a block of pure calcium in the tank for them to nibble on...I’m sure the female will chomp on it regularly when she’s makin eggs.
I highly doubt it, never heard of this before. Dragons need a pure calcium supplement added to their diet (dusted on insects) about every other feeding, depending on their diet. Also, gravid females need additional calcium, like calcium glucionate drops, 3 dropps per 100g, 3x weekly. |
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| 08/24/08 10:39am |
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4Kitara View Profile |
Message To: Clouddancer22 In reference to Message Id: 1841076 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
But I seriously wanted to say that I didn’t mean that the way you took it!!!  I was basicly trying to explain why most of us are so gung ho about bigger vivs and such, and wasn’t saying, AT ALL!, that you didn’t love or care for your dragons!!!!!!! I just know how overwhelming it can be to be told you need a bigger viv and such and was just trying to ease that a lil by explaining it a lil!
Like I said at first, your dragons do look great!!!!! And they wouldn’t look that good if you didn’t take care of em!!!!!! I guess the only thing I’ll say now is that they are ready for a bigger home as soon as you can build one. And sorry I made you feel that way, it truly wasn’t my intention!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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| 08/24/08 11:02am |
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Buiatti View Profile |
Message To: 4Kitara In reference to Message Id: 1841084 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
First of all, I have two Chinese ones, not Aussies, as mentioned by Tarak. J5dragon, you made a little mistake about the seasons times, in South part of the earth, fall is from April to June, winter from July to September, August is the coldest month. I’ve heard that the Aussies are more suitable to be housed together, really different from the Chinese. So there is a big difference here, MrGreen is able to keep 5 Aussie males together, and most of us, can’t keep 2 Chinese males together, so I don’t know how would it be this couple with the time. I have not idea if the males are so "horny" to try mating all the time, as the Chinese do, and I’ve heard a case of a male killing the female, by all this sexual harassment. But I have no idea if the Aussies have the same mating behavior. Now, about the brumation, I only know that Aussies also brumate because once I heard MrGreen mentioning that fall was almost over, and all his Aussies were buried, hiding from the cold. They will start brumating once you reduce their daylight period, even if you have not reduced the temps (this is how happened with mine), I started reducing the daylight period 15 mins per week, starting on fall, and when winter started, I have reduced their daylight from 13 to 10 hours daily. Be sure that they will be in the dark to get a good sleep. About the temps, I would suggest you to make some research on that, looking at how the temps are in Australia. I suppose it wouldn’t vary much from the Chinese, except that I would bet that in Australia, the winter is colder than 70, meaning that you may have to decrease a little more the temps for them, but still higher than in the open areas there, since they may dig and hide from the cold. You will notice that their appetite will reduce, and a lot, but don’t worry, you will also see that they will not loose much weigh. They will start eating just a little, and only about once or twice a week, and will really refuse the food you offer. They do loose weigh, but slowly. Since we still in winter, have no idea how the return from the brumation will be, so I’m sorry for not being able to give more information on that, but there is no science. Increase the daylight period slowly, and raise the temps back to "normal". BUT, I’ve read that it is recommendable to keep them away for some time after leaving the brumation, since they have to recover from the low feeding period. Now, I will go a little on your defense here, regarding the size of your viv. The setups of Moleca and Draco are the same size of yours, and they do like it the way it is (they are always away from each other, except when mating). I can leave their doors open, and they do not leave their viv. Draco does some times scratches the glass, but only when he is sure I’m home (if I’m home, but there is no noise, he does not try to get out). He likes very much to be with me, and even if he is in a place he likes, he may jump in my arm, leg or wherever he is able to reach me. Well, I hope that I was able to be of some help... |
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| 08/24/08 08:35pm |
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Cphill58 View Profile |
Message To: Buiatti In reference to Message Id: 1841514 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
Ty Buiattai ...for answering the call, coming all the way up here from Argentina ....lol...wish you could stay longer... CP |
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| 08/24/08 11:58pm |
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Mr.Greeeeeeen View Profile |
Message To: Cphill58 In reference to Message Id: 1841685 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
I’m not going harp too bad into the cage size it’s already been said and if you decide to stick with what you currently have then lets go from there.... (although I agree with what has been posted... too small!!) If you want to breed them then brumation is an important part of the process. MY AWD’s will settle in around late Oct. mid Nov. Then they will get active again around mid Feb. to March depending on the weather esp... since I keep mine outdoors. Yes you are right about them not nose rubbing, they tend not too and are smart enough to not rub the walls When they have just enough room to move around. Now when you are talking about breeding them they must have room to move and begin the copulation if they don’t then it will not be successful. So cage size and breeding make a big difference. AWD’s can and expect a lower temp during the winter brumation period, so keeping the temps lower and alowing them to regulate to the lower temps then bringing the temps back up in feb / mar. will initiate the breeding period. Make sure to allow alot of water for them to soak in..... Another good suggestion is to send an email to Bert at www.agamainternational.com he is the best in the field and will be glad to help in suggesting the proper breeding method. Hope this helped and welcome to repticZone. OK.... i couldn’t help it if att all possible think of what you can do to get them a bigger cage they will be sooooo much happier and so will you to watch them in a more natural habitat since they love to climb and definatly love their deep water holes.... Good Luck!!!! Mr. G!!!! |
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| 08/26/08 12:15am |
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4Kitara View Profile |
Message To: Mr.Greeeeeeen In reference to Message Id: 1842703 In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice
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| 08/27/08 11:45am |
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In need of some Australian Water Dragon advice| Pages 1 |