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Peas_on_earth View Profile |
Tank size and other stuff
Is a 20 gallon wayyyy too small? The one I’m getting is pretty inactive compared to others I’ve seen. Still, very healthy and plump...eats well and is curious and poops well. I’ve been observing him for quite a while now. He’s not black or dark, but rather a pretty light grey...could he be a she?? Also, where the heck do I get edible flowers? Thanks! |
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| 08/14/08 03:09pm |
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Morgs71 View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1830881 Tank size and other stuff
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| 08/14/08 04:47pm |
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Sahells Mom View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1830881 Tank size and other stuff
Good luck, and let us know what you decide to do! |
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| 08/14/08 04:54pm |
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Peas_on_earth View Profile |
Message To: Sahells Mom In reference to Message Id: 1831003 Tank size and other stuff
A stupid chain store will sell me crap I don’t need, but this is a private place that has never lied to me or sold me some sick animal just to get rid of it. I don’t purchase from chain stores like petco and petsmart. |
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| 08/14/08 11:07pm |
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Rtl402 View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1831364 Tank size and other stuff
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| 08/15/08 08:44am |
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Jbreddawg View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1831364 Tank size and other stuff
Quote: He’s a curious, but just lazy
Uros are anything but lazy . If you have been watching him for months and he seems lazy to you, then there is something not right. Uros are very active reptiles . Constantly on the move , basking,running around , eating,etc... You said you have a "very hot ceramic lamp and a uvb light tube" Do you have a basking spot ? Do you know what your temps are ? |
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| 08/15/08 08:49am |
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Skullkeeper View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1831364 Tank size and other stuff
You need a much larger cage , you should not use alfalfa pellets as a substrate ( it holds moisture ), would need two digital thermometers, a infra red temp. gun,several more lights , money for a vet check/fecal check, and the proper diet of dandelion greens, endive , escarole, bok choy, finch seed, mango and squash. A pet shop will tell you any thing to get your money . They want your money and do not care about the Uro. If you buy it , put it in a 20 gallon aquarium you will end up spending hundreds of dollars on vet bills, a new set up or the Uro will die . |
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| 08/15/08 09:03am |
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Peas_on_earth View Profile |
Message To: Skullkeeper In reference to Message Id: 1831620 Tank size and other stuff
Luckily, I have hundreds of dollars to take care of my pets. I have lots of reptiles...anoles, grass lizards, leopard geckos, and frogs. I’ve spent thousands of dollars on their set ups, lighting, caging, and a wide varity of foods. As I stated before, those chain petstores like Petco and Petsmart are about sales. The place I go to is owned by a lady that is into birds and reptiles. One of her employees has taken care of my animals while I was on vacation and I get almost everything from him. Lets face it, petshops are never perfect...they do put animals in smaller cages that need bigger cages. When I first laid eyes on Steve, he was in a small 10 gallon tank...he dug around here and there, was playful and curious, but generally lazy, yes, Lazy. My set up for him includes everything he needs..his super hot lamp, uvb, a variaty of veggies, and hides. Those pellets do anything but hold moisture. They’re dry and hold heat pretty well. He’s been on them his whole life and he likes to dig around in it. I really doubt I’ll end up with a dead steve..but thanks for the words of encouragement anyways folks. |
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| 08/15/08 01:07pm |
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Uro_fan View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1831815 Tank size and other stuff
Quote: My set up for him includes everything he needs..his super hot lamp, uvb, a variaty of veggies, and hides. Those pellets do anything but hold moisture. They’re dry and hold heat pretty well.
Your setup will be inadequate and likely harmful if you plan on using a 20-gallon. If the pet store that you are boasting about being different and better than others had this animal in a 10 gallon and is fine with you placing the animal in a 20 gallon- they are no different from the pet stores that people complain about on these forums. The alfalfa pellets are highly absorbent, will retain moisture, and will make a perfect living environment for bacteria and other microorganisms. The fact that this animal is inactive is a bad sign not a good sign pea. Don’t ya love the inexperienced youngsters (assumption based solely on writing style) that show up asking a simple question like is a 20-gallon way to small, receive 100 % feedback from experienced members that the enclosure is way too small, and then make a point of arguing with everyone? Lol |
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| 08/15/08 01:25pm |
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Peas_on_earth View Profile |
Message To: Uro_fan In reference to Message Id: 1831827 Tank size and other stuff
And while I might be young, mid 20s, I’m far from uneducated. Please don’t assume I’m some dumb teenager. I hate how "experienced" people assume that all animals of a species are all cookie cutter. True that most things are, like diet and heating essentials. However, I’ve found that there are exceptions. Steve is a lazy . He runs around, digs a little, sit in his food bowl to eat, then find a corner to poopie head. Most of the time, he lays on his rock under the bulb. He’s no a skinny boy, he’s not a sick boy, he’s healthy but just lazy. Sorry my Steve isn’t some track runner or olympic gold medalist, but he’s a healthy boy. Regardless, I’m not here to argue with anyone...I’m also not here for people to point fingers and assume I’m pet abuser because I’m temporarily holding Steve in a 20 gallon. You want to pick on someone about abusing pets? Write a letter to Petco. |
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| 08/15/08 03:34pm |
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Peas_on_earth View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1831956 Tank size and other stuff
If the replies I got were simply, "no, it’s not big enough; I’m go bigger like a 40 or 60 gallo", I would have shared the fact that this was only a temporary set up until I finish building a much bigger tank. The care sheets I’ve read all said that a 20 gallon is minimum, but I was unsure if anyone actually kept a uro in a 20 gallon. But since everyone was quick to call me an idiot basically, I’ll be moving to an information source that isn’t so hostile. |
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| 08/15/08 03:49pm |
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Skullkeeper View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1831971 Tank size and other stuff
The care sheets you have looked at are wrong.No one called you an idiot .But you have been misinformed.Now if you take the advice of the pet store over experienced uro owners and breeders well, then maybe your are an idiot . Check out Link andLink |
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| 08/15/08 04:24pm |
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Jaffar View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1831971 Tank size and other stuff
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| 08/15/08 04:33pm |
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Uro_fan View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1831971 Tank size and other stuff
Quote: ”Have you come across a petstore, any petstore, that is absolutely dead on about housing? I doubt it because it’s seen as a temporary home. “
I have seen pet stores that have done a far better job of housing uromastyx in enclosures larger than a 10 gallon. This is not about what most pet stores do. This is about you bragging about a pet store that is not like the rest while posting that the pet store housed this uromastyx in a ten gallon and you watched this uromastyx for months. Quote: ”And while I might be young, mid 20s, I’m far from uneducated. Please don’t assume I’m some dumb teenager.”
I am not assuming anything. I simply posted my impression based on your writing style. If this makes you feel as if I view you as dumb and uneducated, there is nothing I can do about that. Quote: ”I hate how "experienced" people assume that all animals of a species are all cookie cutter. True that most things are, like diet and heating essentials.”
And this is exactly what we are talking about in this thread pea- enclosure size and temperatures for a reptile that has higher basking and gradient temperature requirements than most other reptiles seen in the hobby. Proper temperatures have everything to do with the activity level of a uromastyx. You need to attempt to add the 1+1 to get 2 pea. Quote: ”However, I’ve found that there are exceptions. Steve is a lazy . Most of the time, he lays on his rock under the bulb. He’s no a skinny boy, he’s not a sick boy, he’s healthy but just lazy. Sorry my Steve isn’t some track runner or olympic gold medalist, but he’s a healthy boy.”
As you have a whole whopping 12 hours of experience with this species, I would say that you should start listening to people that have kept multiple uromastyx for years. You are not qualified to judge whether the behavior you are seeing is normal and to think otherwise might have members believing you are a dumb teenager and we certainly don’t want that. Quote: ”I’m also not here for people to point fingers and assume I’m pet abuser because I’m temporarily holding Steve in a 20 gallon.”
Then your best course of action would be to have a proper enclosure prior to purchasing the reptile as multiple members have suggested. Knowing prior to purchase that this 20 gallon is not a proper living environment for any period of time and purchasing the animal anyway is selfish and irresponsible. Quote: ”If the replies I got were simply, "no, it’s not big enough; I’m go bigger like a 40 or 60 gallo", I would have shared the fact that this was only a temporary set up until I finish building a much bigger tank.
Did you read these replies? Lol Quote: The care sheets I’ve read all said that a 20 gallon is minimum,
I find it hard to believe that there are too many sites recommending 20 gallon fish tanks. For every care sheet that exists suggesting a 20 gallon is minimum, my guess is that there are ten showing that a 20 gallon is not acceptable. Selective reading to fit a desire? Quote: ” But since everyone was quick to call me an idiot basically, I’ll be moving to an information source that isn’t so hostile.”
Let me translate- I am finding a site where no one cares what horrific conditions I keep my uromastyx in. There are plenty of them pea and I am sure you will fit right in with the members that post on those sites. |
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| 08/15/08 04:35pm |
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Uro_fan View Profile |
Message To: Uro_fan In reference to Message Id: 1832027 Tank size and other stuff
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| 08/15/08 04:59pm |
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Peas_on_earth View Profile |
Message To: Uro_fan In reference to Message Id: 1832056 Tank size and other stuff
Yes, I did read the replies; they all sounded like people screaming at me. A simple yes or no with a suggestion would have been fine...all that extra stuff is just people trying to point fingers. It’s one thing to tell me that a 20 gallon is not preferred and a bigger cage is recommended. It’s a complete another thing to basically patronize me. I can read and I can comprehend what I read. This site, reptilezone, has been very helpful when it comes to my Anoles and leopard geckos. I assumed that the uro section of this site would be equally helpful since I’m found that most of the people in the other pages are friendly and knowledgable. Apparently, I’m wrong. And why did I ask the question? I wanted opinion, NOT criticism. Lastly, I didn’t buy this 20 gallons specifically for Steve, I had this tank for a while. And I’ve noticed, Uro_fan, that you’re quite belligerent in other posts to other people just trying to get a question answered as well. I realize that being on the web makes it pretty anonymous and all, but that’s no excuse to be so rude. I get it, you’re knowledgable about uros; no one is contending that. But seriously, lighten up. It’s quite possible for you to be the scholar of this forum and NOT be rude about it. |
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| 08/15/08 05:37pm |
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Jbreddawg View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1831956 Tank size and other stuff
Quote: I seriously don’t think Steve is sick or too skinny or unhappy. He looks like a healthy and satisfied uro.
No, Steve actually looks pretty good for the moment. But if you are a responsible adult and you have taken on the responsibility of this pets health then don’t you think listening to people who have years of actual hands on experience would be beneficial ? Quote: Most of the time, he lays on his rock under the bulb.
Hopefully , you will take some good advice from everyone, continue on with your cage project "quickly I hope " and will soon see that Steve isn’t quite as lazy as you think he is . |
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| 08/15/08 05:49pm |
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Peas_on_earth View Profile |
Message To: Jbreddawg In reference to Message Id: 1832100 Tank size and other stuff
I’m here so I can have access to the correct information from people with experience. At the same time, just because I’m a bit of a newbie to uros doesn’t mean those with knowledge has the right to patronize me. There’s nothing wrong with giving me info and answering questions RESPECTFULLY. That’s all I’m saying. I’m open to suggestions and advice...I’m not open to insults and patronizing. And as far as the pellets go, I’ve kept leopard geckos on them no problem. Steve has been on these pellets all his life and he’s fine. They only hold moisture when you wet them..I’m not doing that. |
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| 08/15/08 06:19pm |
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MissAnne2u View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1832127 Tank size and other stuff
Quote: And as far as the pellets go, I’ve kept leopard geckos on them no problem. Steve has been on these pellets all his life and he’s fine. They only hold moisture when you wet them..I’m not doing that.
Peas..... You may not be wetting them, but your Uro is everytime he goes to the bathroom. And let me tell you, they PEE A LOT !!! I was really surprised at how much water they pee out. You may want to seriously reconsider the substrate you are using. Personally, I like Pool Filter Sand, but alot of people used Washed, sifted Play Sand or millet seeds (they can get moldy too by the way). Also I didn’t see any digital thermometers, they are really cheap and you should invest in at least two, one for each end of the enclosure and an infared temp gun (about $25.00 or less) to find out the true temps, dial thermometers can be off by as much as 15 degrees. I found that out the hard way. As for the tank size, the Gallons of a tank don’t matter, its the footprint of the tank that matters. 48"x24"x24" is the bare minimum for one Uro, but bigger is better. Good Luck. |
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| 08/15/08 06:38pm |
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Jbreddawg View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1832127 Tank size and other stuff
Ok, I do have to address this quote though. Quote: Steve has been on these pellets all his life and he’s fine.
I’ve been on here for quite awhile now . You really have no idea how many times someone says ’well he’s been in this cage ,eating this, had these lights ,etc... all his life and he’s still fine . Just because he’s surviving doesn’t mean he’s thriving . Alive doesn’t mean healthy . Uros grow very slowly and can take months to actually years to show signs of improper husbandry . If you really want the best for your uro , take him off the pellets . There for rabbits not uros. Everytime a uro goes to the bathroom "and it’s alot" they let out liquid . where do you think that goes ? It soaks into the substrate . Pellets can and will mold . |
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| 08/15/08 06:50pm |
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Peas_on_earth View Profile |
Message To: Jbreddawg In reference to Message Id: 1832158 Tank size and other stuff
I’ll look into it. My tank has sliding doors as one of the walls and a piece of glass on the bottom parallel to the sliding doors so the substrate doesn’t fall out when the doors open, make sense? I do have play sand and will try that. However, I do take about an hour every morning to spot clean tanks. When I take out the poop, I take out that and the surrounding and underneath substrate as well. Steve’s new tank is more square than rectagle. It’s only 16 inches high since they don’t climb or anything. I’m not here for anyone to tell me how handsome Steve is...I already know that! I just want him to be a happy boy. =) And he will be tomorrow when I move him into his gigantic cube. Seriously, it’s like half the size of my bed...and then some. Heck, I could probably sleep in it! |
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| 08/15/08 07:42pm |
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Jbreddawg View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1832201 Tank size and other stuff
Quote: they don’t climb or anything
yea right lol !!!!! tell that to everyone on here whos "fat and lazy non climbing lizard" has escaped !! If you’ve seen the thread with my cage build , they use every square inch top to bottom of it. |
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| 08/15/08 08:30pm |
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Goonyone View Profile |
Message To: Jbreddawg In reference to Message Id: 1832263 Tank size and other stuff
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| 08/15/08 09:19pm |
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Uro_fan View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1832201 Tank size and other stuff
Quote: ”Second, I asked because I wanted to get opinion other than what I’ve been reading from caresheets.”
The point is, why ask for opinion if 100% of the people tell you one thing and you do another? You are wasting our time with questions about enclosure size and alfalfa pellet substrate if you have no intent on listening to the answer you ask for. Quote: Yes, I did read the replies; they all sounded like people screaming at me.
No one was screaming at you, they just didn’t tell you what you wanted to hear and when you started debating the advice you were given, people defended their statements and advice. Quote: A simple yes or no with a suggestion would have been fine...all that extra stuff is just people trying to point fingers.
Finger pointing? You had not even purchased the animal yet. What you read was members strongly suggesting you not move forward with buying a uromastyx and putting it in a 20 gallon fish tank. Quote: ”It’s one thing to tell me that a 20 gallon is not preferred and a bigger cage is recommended. It’s a complete another thing to basically patronize me. I can read and I can comprehend what I read.”
So you comprehended everything that was explained to you about uromastyx, the high basking and heat requirements, and how it is impossible to achieve a proper basking and gradient temperature in this small of an enclosure and you decided to purchase the uromastyx anyway and throw it in the 20 gallon? You might have read but you certainly did not comprehend. I love it when people come to this forum without experience, ask for help, and then disagree and debate most of the advice they receive and then turn around acting all victimized. Ever hear the expression if you can’t take the heat? Well, similarly- if you don’t want to hear advice that differs from what you want to hear- don’t ask the question just to debate the issue and then turn around and whine about how mean everyone is. Most people that truly want to avoid controversy do not start the controversy and place themselves right smack dab in the middle and continue to fuel the fire. Quote: ”And why did I ask the question? I wanted opinion, NOT criticism.”
The criticism came about from your refusal to listen to the advice you asked for and your attempt to debate topics you have absolutely no experience in debating. I see you used the opinions really well- 100% feedback that the 20 was too small and you buy the animal and stick it in the 20 anyway. Quote: I don’t purchase from chain stores like petco and petsmart.
Yes you do, you have posted about it several times on this website including a recent ‘rescue’ from one of these stores on Aug 8. Quote: And I’ve noticed, Uro_fan, that you’re quite belligerent in other posts to other people just trying to get a question answered as well.
I don’t like liars, people that exaggerate, those that place their own selfish desires over the welfare of their animals, and those that show up here with little or no valid experience asking questions and then arguing with people when they offer valid advice. Find me a few posts where I have been belligerent where some of these things haven’t occurred. I didn’t come into this thread until the 9th post and that was because I was tired of watching your BS and being disrespectful to those who stepped up to help you. I have no problem pointing out your inconsistencies and negligent actions and feel no need to be kind and gentle when doing it. Quote: ”I’m here so I can have access to the correct information from people with experience. At the same time, just because I’m a bit of a newbie to uros doesn’t mean those with knowledge has the right to patronize me.
The feedback you are seeing has nothing to do with being a newbie, it has everything to do with your posts/actions so far on this forum. Quote: ”I’m open to suggestions and advice...I’m not open to insults and patronizing.”
You confuse this forum’s lack of willingness to put up with your refusal to do what is in the best interest of the animal and attempt to debate all advice you ask for with being insulting and patronizing. You would have a really rude awakening if members of this forum actually decided to be insulting and patronizing. Quote: And as far as the pellets go, I’ve kept leopard geckos on them no problem. Steve has been on these pellets all his life and he’s fine. They only hold moisture when you wet them..I’m not doing that.
And I used to keep my cichlids in brackish water, think that might work for your uros too? The husbandry of leopard geckos has nothing to do with the husbandry of uromastyx. Quote: This site, reptilezone, has been very helpful when it comes to my Anoles and leopard geckos. I assumed that the uro section of this site would be equally helpful since I’m found that most of the people in the other pages are friendly and knowledgable. Apparently, I’m wrong.
Hmm… I thought I would do a few quick searches to validate the above statements and found that not only have you complained about being criticized on other forums when someone disagreed with your actions, you appear to be a collector with a lot of unhealthy animals. In the short time you have been on this forum (little over a month) you have expressed interest in a number of animals and have been collecting left and right while posting about health issues and dying animals. Here are just a few of the things I saw: 7/20 purchased a skinny female leopard gecko and placed immediately in with male without quarantine and had aggressive biting. Nine days later you are posting about how the male stopped eating and I think (would need to go back and check) the male might have died. Previous to this you picked up some toad headed agama. 7/21 you post that you picked up a very skinny gargoyle gecko that won’t eat. 7/24 you start posting on this forum about possibly buying a uromastyx. 7/28 you post that you are looking for a chameleon that only grows to about 4”. Later that same day you post that you just got a baby pacman and are wondering if it is hibernating or sick, 7/30 you are posting about having a pair of frogs where one died, 7/31 you post about pair of viper geckos where one is seriously ill (started posting about this animal being ill on 7/10) and when someone recommends separating them, you argue with them and post a few days later that the animal died. 8/4 you post about rescuing a thin leopard gecko from a store you posted on this forum that you NEVER shop at- petsmart and received some ‘criticism”. This animal died 4 days ago 8/8 you post that you recently bought a dekay snake. 8/13 you are off inquiring on the care of Cuban anoles. 8/15 you are back here posting about buying a ’lazy’ uromastyx and throwing in a 20 gallon after your received overwhelming feedback not to place the animal in this small enclosure. In the brief time you have been posting on this forum I cannot keep straight all of the purchases you made, references to sick animal, your description of many of your animals as being ‘lazy’ and the multiple deaths you have posted about. I am literally appalled at what I read . On top of this, you are posting with questions about basic diet for all of these animals which tells me you do not have much experience at all. You should not be purchasing ANY animals and it is evident by what I read that anyone attempting to help you is wasting their time unless they just happen to tell you what it is you wanted to hear. Disturbing to say the least. |
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| 08/15/08 09:21pm |
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Peas_on_earth View Profile |
Message To: Goonyone In reference to Message Id: 1832311 Tank size and other stuff
The holes are pretty big so he’s not having a lot of issues with it. I’ll keep an eye on him in case he does get stuck. |
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| 08/15/08 10:18pm |
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Peas_on_earth View Profile |
Message To: Uro_fan In reference to Message Id: 1832315 Tank size and other stuff
But I’m not going to defend myself to you because I don’t have to =) If you have this image that all my animals are crammed into a box or something, that’s your problem. Everyone else seems to understand what I meant about feeling patronized except you. And the fact that you probably put in quality time to write this reply really makes me think you’re a little mental. I mean, you’re probably the type that doesn’t let anything go...EVER. Ashame that you’re knowledgable about Uros. I hope you treat them more respectfully than the people in this forum. And did you google me as well? I mean, do I have to worry about you stalking me or what! I’ll get a restraining order ;). I was thinking about offering you to stop by my house and "inspect" the quality of my animals, but this whole "stalking" thing has me scared. I also have 2 cats and a boyfriend...would you like to know how they’re doing as well? *I’m amused* |
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| 08/15/08 10:29pm |
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El toro View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1832392 Tank size and other stuff
Quote: *I’m amused* You should be less amused and more ashamed. Be honest with yourself and fix what needs to be fixed. |
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| 08/15/08 10:40pm |
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Jbreddawg View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1832392 Tank size and other stuff
Quote: And they’re all healthy and have their necessities and then some met.
Does that include the sickly,lazy,and dead ones ? |
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| 08/15/08 10:42pm |
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Skullkeeper View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1832392 Tank size and other stuff
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| 08/15/08 10:54pm |
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Skullkeeper View Profile |
Message To: Peas_on_earth In reference to Message Id: 1832392 Tank size and other stuff
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| 08/15/08 10:58pm |
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