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 #2315545


Otto Glott
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 This place bites

Bunch of judgmental, unhelpful children is all I seem to get responses from. Came on here to share and learn and all I get is attacked, before I am heard as to why I am doing as I doing. No wonder this place seems dead. Everything seems cool until someone sees your keeping a hatchling in a well furnished glass enclosure, then it turns into "idiot, your killing the monitor, or get a beardie". The mods need to create a less hostile atmosphere.



11/05/15  11:04pm

 #2315552


3240
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315545


 This place bites

You weren’t attacked. You did the attacking.



11/06/15  06:23am

 #2315555


Otto Glott
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  Message To: 3240   In reference to Message Id: 2315552


 This place bites

You did, think you’re all knowing authority as if you know me and my abilities anymore than I know yours.



11/06/15  08:45am

 #2315556


3240
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315555


 This place bites

Otto, I have a lot of experience (over 25 years) raising and breeding monitors that I’m more than happy to share. I’ve had my share of failures and successes and, because of these experience, I feel very comfortable giving advice. You have a 4 month argus which is a great monitor and a great start. But, your experience is limited to articles that you’ve read on the internet. Not sure why you’re so defensive.

I see you’ve moved onto varanus.***. Change your attitude or it’s not going to be a good experience for you.



11/06/15  09:03am

 #2315557


Takahiro111
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315545


 This place bites

Tanks aren’t the best for housing monitors no matter what age...I don’t know what happen but they are a few disrespectful people on this site but most is very helpful. 3240 gives some good info on monitors as well as some other people as I tend to lean more close to people that has more experience in these lizards like him when I’m in a pinch. I’ll also help with whatever you need...not as many years as 3240 but I only have 13-14 years in experience lol.



11/06/15  09:45am

 #2315560


Yaksha
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  Message To: Takahiro111   In reference to Message Id: 2315557


 This place bites

Otto, i am not sure how you feel you are being attacked.. i get annoyed when people get offensive/defensive over receiving good advice. Personally when i give advice on monitor keeping i dont care about the persons feelings, i give advice based on what is best for the animal. If your doing something wrong and jeopardizing the health of the animal, i am going to say so. These are awesome creatures and should be treated as such, they are not your typical pet. Also the reason this site is almost dead is because good monitor keepers got tired of giving the same advice to people who just ignored them, or attacked them cause they didnt want to hear that they were doing something wrong. (and then wonder why there pet died after 2-3 years)
this is what is wrong with the site,
again we dont care about your feelings only that you are properly caring for the animal.

Amanda



11/06/15  10:42am

 #2315562


3240
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315555


 This place bites

You’re the one who started thread after thread of beginner/basic questions making it clear that you were new to the hobby. (Nothing wrong with being new and asking questions). But, for some strange reason you don’t like the answers because you’ve read a few internet articles? Why ask such basic questions if you already have the answers and you aren’t willing to take simple advice from someone who’s been there and done that?

To answer your question, people don’t post often because they got sick and tired of arguing with folks that have no experience. Most experienced keepers are now members of private forums. That way they don’t have to debate about simple things like the use of a fogger/humidifier. I saw your post on varanus about argus vs. niles. You’re really going to go there with Frank? I’m glad he ignored you so far because you seem to get your feelings hurt easily.



11/06/15  12:05pm

 #2315568


Otto Glott
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  Message To: 3240   In reference to Message Id: 2315562


 This place bites

Krusty wrote a good article that I took seriously:http://www.reptilesmagazine.com/Care-Sheets/Lizards/Argus-Monitor/ If I’m doing it wrong, then Krusty is wrong too. If reading books is considered poor research 3420 is an idiot and your 25 years of experience is void. Should have stayed a lurker, but I suppose there are other sites with more patient and friendly people. You attacked me, even if I am inexperienced I know how to research properly and I am not using my glass terrarium much longer anyway. Glass type enclosures are a to work with anyways. Have a nice life 3420 and thanks to all those who were friendly and helpful.



11/06/15  02:13pm

 #2315569


Otto Glott
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  Message To: Yaksha   In reference to Message Id: 2315560


 This place bites

My Fiona is fine, she has 8" of substrate, 126f basking spot, 70% rh, and 4x2x2 with 75% covered in plexiglas and a towel. I am building a 10 x 5 x 5 home for her. She is captive bred and I have asked Krusty questions personally here on the site. So, side wide 3420 if you want but I am good at research and this was not an impulse buy. Also she is captive bred from East Bay Vivarium here in Berkley, CA. I drove an hour to hand pick the best looking specimen. I am done, have a nice day.



11/06/15  02:19pm

 #2315570


3240
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315568


 This place bites

Otto,

You’re either delusional or very young. I’m guessing young. You weren’t attacked. You attacked once I told you that a humidifier is not necessary. Why? I’m not sure. I know Justin (aka Krusty). Have for a long time. He’s a great guy and knows his stuff. Reading is very important but so is practice and experience. I have two hobbies that I really enjoy besides reptiles. Strongman/crossfit training and I race cars for fun. I’ve been doing both for a long time and have gotten pretty good. By your logic, you only need to read a book and you’re caught up with me and good to go! It doesn’t work that way. You need to apply what you’ve read in real life, over a course of years, before you really get the hang of it.

Not sure what you’re talking about when it comes to glass enclosures. Are you referring to the acrylic that I use to build a top for my troughs? Or the glass doors and windows on my large enclosures? Are you building an enclosure without glass? No glass windows, no glass doors? Just a box that you can’t see into? If you’re not a fan of acrylic tops and glass windows you’re going to really hate Krusty’s enclosures.

Unfortunately, you’re going to find the other sites to be a little less patient. This is as friendly as it gets! Grow up.



11/06/15  02:42pm

 #2315571


3240
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  Message To: 3240   In reference to Message Id: 2315570


 This place bites

Otto,

Here’s an easy enclosure for you. This is one of mine. Your buddy Krusty uses them, FR uses them, etc. The top is acrylic with a hinge in the middle. That way one side can be opened at a time. The light bulb is inside of the enclosure. I bet its been 3 or 4 months since I’ve added any water to the substrate. The humidity stays high, without a humidifier, and the temps are ideal, without needing a large wattage bulb.

Troughs are excellent because they are nearly indestructible and can hold a lot of substrate. Right now this trough is being used as a raise up cage for a young pair of Saba Island iguanas.

[URL=https://imageshack.com/i/p81EiYJmj]

[/URL]
[URL=https://imageshack.com/i/pbHUAV8qj]

[/URL]
[URL=https://imageshack.com/i/p8d5vxbfj]

[/URL]



11/06/15  03:10pm

 #2315573


Otto Glott
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  Message To: 3240   In reference to Message Id: 2315571


 This place bites

Mine is 8"deep and very moist with or without humidifier. My argus has many homes dug she burrows in and besides I will be finished with my large permanent enclosure by December. Thank you for the advice; sorry for being mean and nasty(maybe I’m a monitor lizard at heart).



11/06/15  03:29pm

 #2315574


3240
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315573


 This place bites

No worries Otto. What are your large enclosure plans? Maybe I can help.



11/06/15  03:43pm

 #2315576


Otto Glott
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  Message To: 3240   In reference to Message Id: 2315574


 This place bites

10x5x5, is as big as I can go in my room. I am using a program called sketchup to make a 3D model so my brother in law has something to go by. I only decided with an Argus because I could not find a person who breeds Dumeril’s in my area. Berkeley had just hatched several panoptes and I jumped at the opportunity. East Bay Vivarium is the only place I could find in northern California who has many monitors they breed to choose from. This is my second attempt at keeping monitors, I failed at 14 with two savannahs (lost one and gave the other up to an experienced person), so I am really trying to be like an amateur herpetologist by keeping a journal, tracking her food intake and feeding her in my bathtub with rubber mats for traction. I don’t soak her in water like other people who don’t know better. Just giving you a brief summary of my last 4 months keeping up with Fiona (if female).



11/06/15  04:28pm

 #2315579


Yaksha
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315576


 This place bites

I dont know why you are feeding her in a tub.



11/06/15  08:48pm

 #2315581


Otto Glott
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  Message To: Yaksha   In reference to Message Id: 2315579


 This place bites

Afraid that she’d eat dirt and I like to count how many items she eats. The main reason is because the tank is a pain to work in and she is really close to jumping out. I have the person to build for me and now I am saving the money to build an enclosure that will last her whole life and feed her in too. The good thing is even though she huffs and puffs at me, she has reached a point where I may pick her up without lunging for me or running away. She chases the crickets all over the tub with so much enthusiasm. I believe she may have acclimated to my clinical way of feeding her. The shower mats provide lots of traction and if she poops (she poops before eating almost every feeding) cleaning it is easy.



11/06/15  09:58pm

 #2315582


Otto Glott
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315581


 Fiona under substrate

[URL=http://s1067.photobucket.com/user/adamh636/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2015-11/IMG_20151106_203940_zps0ntr7ggr.jpg.html]

[/URL]



11/06/15  10:22pm

 #2315583


Otto Glott
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315582


 Fiona under substrate

[URL=http://s1067.photobucket.com/user/adamh636/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2015-11/IMG_20151106_204325_zps3a8hcliq.jpg.html]

[/URL]

[URL=http://s1067.photobucket.com/user/adamh636/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2015-11/IMG_20151106_204618_zpsfd4wwuzf.jpg.html]

[/URL]

[URL=http://s1067.photobucket.com/user/adamh636/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2015-10/IMG_20151018_194947_zpswgbqprjn.jpg.html]

[/URL]



11/06/15  10:26pm

 #2315585


Yaksha
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315583


 Fiona under substrate

Dirt wont harm them.



11/06/15  11:37pm

 #2315590


Mdf
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315583


 Fiona under substrate

Otto, 3240 has many years of experience under his belt, read and learn :)



11/07/15  11:57am

 #2315592


Otto Glott
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  Message To: Mdf   In reference to Message Id: 2315590


 Fiona under substrate

I will, I wish I could know some of you in person because I have yet to find a single monitor enthusiast here in my hometown. Having a person like 3420 or anyone with years of hands on would be the so awesome; just having a friend with the same interest would be sweet. I’m 35 years old and have only met one man ten years older with a black throat, but he was too into using drugs (not just marijuana either) and made me uncomfortable. People at my local petsmart tell me of a dude who brings in a very large monitor, they don’t know the species, so maybe I will meet him sometime.



11/07/15  01:47pm

 #2315594


Takahiro111
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315592


 Fiona under substrate

I haven’t met any reptile owners were I live either lol...I have been thinking of getting another monitor even though I said I wasn’t getting another reptile



11/07/15  06:55pm

 #2315596


3240
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315581


 This place bites

Otto,

Don’t jump right into building a 10’ enclosure. You do want to get her out of her current enclosure soon but I’d recommend you find a decent sized metal trough first. If you don’t like the looks of the exposed trough you can always build a structure around it to make it look nicer. Fill it with substrate, something that will actually hold a burrow, and build a solid top for it. You want the light mounted inside. Something simple like I posted above. A nice sized trough will buy you some time and they’re not expensive. Argus are awesome, one of my favorites, but they’re a 4’ to 5’ handful. Don’t invest in a monster enclosure until you’re sure that this is the species for you.

I strongly recommend that you not house a large argus (or any large species) in a room that you live in or spend a lot of time in. Large monitors stink!!! No matter how clean you keep the enclosure it will stink up the room. Also, a large enclosure in a small room can really heat up the entire room. Nothing worse then a bedroom that is stinky and too warm!

There will come a time, sooner than later, when handling your argus will become uncomfortable. They’re high energy monitors with powerful tails and claws. That’s what makes them awesome! But, a 4’ argus does not like to be held or constrained. So, feeding your monitor outside of its enclosure is not necessary and will become nearly impossible soon. It also causes undo stress. Don’t worry if she ingests some substrate. It will pass right through her.

Honestly, if my space was limited I would keep nothing but dwarf species. A pair of ackies, kingorum, or gilleni, are the ultimate captives in my opinion. They have all of the personality of the larger species but don’t take up nearly the space.



11/08/15  09:13am

 #2315598


Otto Glott
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  Message To: 3240   In reference to Message Id: 2315596


 This place bites

Dwarf species were way too much money or I would have bought one. I met the parents of my Fiona before I paid for her and their size did not intimidate me at all. I am too deep into this to just up and get rid of her, even if I wanted no one would trade my argus for a much more expensive dwarf species. Ackie are $350-450 each, tree monitors aren’t in my budget, especially since this is my second attempt at keeping a monitor. East Bay Vivarium had full sized dumeril’s but I only had my 4x2x2 enclosure, if they had baby dumeril’s that is what I originally wanted. I really did my research and I know this isn’t ideal for a first varanid, but I could have gotten a Nile for $40 like all ingnorant new keepers right ;0) I guess you think I’m dumb for getting her, all I read and after seeing her parents they are mid sized monitors, but I know individual size can vary.



11/08/15  01:26pm

 #2315599


3240
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315598


 This place bites

Otto,

Unfortunately, you made a very common and easy to make mistake. A pair of ackies, at $1,000, is far less expensive than an argus or nile. If your argus were given to you free of charge you would have been better off financially with a pair of $1000 ackies.

Argus monitors are eating machines. They have an incredibly fast metabolism. Have you priced rodents? Figure on your argus eating 15 plus large mice per week. Let’s call it $15 - $25 per week in food. A properly built to last enclosure is going to cost you $1,000. Now add electrical costs. Food and electricity will run you a $1,000 per year. So, $1,000 per year in food and electricity plus a $1,000 enclosure. Plus, your current investment in your existing enclosure will be a throw away.

Ackies don’t need near the enclosure size, eat insects and the occasional pinkie, and the enclosure won’t require near the electrical power. You can build a killer ackie enclosure for about $200.00 and food and electricity might run you $250 per year. Simple math says a monitor worth $350 - $1,000 is much, much cheaper than a large monitor that is given away for free.

Now add in time to maintain an argus vs. an ackie. What’s your time worth?

Buying a monitor is the easy and cheap part. My advice to anyone on a budget. Buy a dwarf monitor.



11/08/15  02:21pm

 #2315604


Otto Glott
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  Message To: 3240   In reference to Message Id: 2315599


 This place bites

I disagree, I can afford my monitor or I wouldn’t have purchased her. 10x6x5 so far cost me less than 200 bucks but 500 tops. Not trying to argue but I am aware of the feeding costs not to mention mice aren’t going to be the only food offered.



11/08/15  03:18pm

 #2315605


3240
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315604


 This place bites

Read my post again Otto. $1000 ackies are cheaper than a free Argus. Nothing to argue, it’s very simple math.



11/08/15  05:07pm

 #2315608


Otto Glott
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  Message To: 3240   In reference to Message Id: 2315605


 This place bites

Nah, not simple, nothing is that black and white.



11/08/15  06:35pm

 #2315610


3240
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  Message To: Otto Glott   In reference to Message Id: 2315608


 This place bites

Some things are very black and white. Things like the cost of an enclosure, the cost of a mouse, and the cost of electricity. Doesn’t get more black and white. Was the sell price of your argus a "gray area"? I’m guessing not.

I can say with 100% certainty that your annual cost to maintain an argus will far exceed the cost to maintain an ackie by multiples. It will make the ackie seem inexpensive.

Take a stab at your argus budget. What’s a 10x5x5 foot enclosure going to cost? How many mice do you think an adult argus eats on a weekly basis? What’s the cost of a large mouse?



11/08/15  07:17pm

 #2315612


3240
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  Message To: 3240   In reference to Message Id: 2315610


 This place bites

Otto,

I found the picture I wanted to show you. This enclosure would have been perfect for a lone argus. I housed two Egyptian Uros in it. I used two large metal troughs and built a structure around it. It worked great and I think it would work well for you.
[URL=https://imageshack.com/i/1ddirt334iz4j]

[/URL]
[URL=https://imageshack.com/i/41emerine005op4j]

[/URL]
[URL=https://imageshack.com/i/2kemerine004vw0j]

[/URL]



11/08/15  07:29pm

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