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SalvatorREX View Profile |
Monitor intelligence/training
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| 06/13/12 04:34pm |
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Aragarnn View Profile |
Message To: SalvatorREX In reference to Message Id: 2269904 Monitor intelligence/training
To be honest though I don’t know about all this and how well it’s remembered to them due to the chance it may be just habit. I say that because now tongs are it’s target and depending on how often I’m in the reptile room some weeks it associates me with food due to me usually being in there to solely feed. I do believe it’s all dependent upon being fed as the goal, and nothing more, probably more amusing to us than them. |
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| 06/13/12 04:44pm |
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SalvatorREX View Profile |
Message To: Aragarnn In reference to Message Id: 2269907 Monitor intelligence/training
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| 06/13/12 07:03pm |
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Varanus_odom View Profile |
Message To: SalvatorREX In reference to Message Id: 2269934 Monitor intelligence/training
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| 06/13/12 07:41pm |
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Crocdoc View Profile |
Message To: SalvatorREX In reference to Message Id: 2269934 Monitor intelligence/training
For a while I had my male trained to come to his name (and/or a hand clap) so that I could put him back in the enclosure to be fed. There had to be a long delay between my signals and the reward (ie food), otherwise he’d just come running over biting, so it was important that he knew he had to go back into the enclosure to be fed. In the end this, too, became dangerous for when I would go to lift him into the enclosure he’d already have food on his mind and I had to be careful not to trigger a feeding response. Lace monitors can be insane when it comes to food. Here’s an old video I did when we still had that feeding routine: (the video link doesn’t seem to be working in the preview, so remove the space from this URL and paste it in your browser: http://www.you tube.com/watch?v=7NIOeF2ICmo&feature=plcp) Another routine I’ve taught my monitors is a particular process for being let out of the enclosure for a wander around. They have to wait quietly at the right hand side of the enclosure (no glass scratching) and then, when I reach in with my hand, they put their left forearm into my hand, between my thumb and forefinger, so I can lift them out. I made a video when I first started training them to do this a few years ago but will put together another video in a couple of months or so showing their progress. They’re amazing at it, now, and will often wait for me with their arms already raised. Here’s the older video: (the video link doesn’t seem to be working in the preview, so remove the space from this URL and paste it in your browser: http://www.you tube.com/watch?v=PxeB8kYPP0A&feature=plcp) |
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| 06/13/12 07:56pm |
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Aragarnn View Profile |
Message To: Crocdoc In reference to Message Id: 2269939 Monitor intelligence/training
Your guys are quite remarkable. Cody |
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| 06/14/12 01:06pm |
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SalvatorREX View Profile |
Message To: Crocdoc In reference to Message Id: 2269939 Monitor intelligence/training
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| 06/14/12 07:12pm |
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Crocdoc View Profile |
Message To: SalvatorREX In reference to Message Id: 2270035 Monitor intelligence/training
They’re 12 years old this coming (southern) spring. |
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| 06/14/12 07:49pm |
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Daryl- View Profile |
Message To: Crocdoc In reference to Message Id: 2270048 Monitor intelligence/training
Like I said, I know they are different, but would still be interested. Cheers Daryl |
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| 06/15/12 05:32am |
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Krusty View Profile |
Message To: Daryl- In reference to Message Id: 2270082 Monitor intelligence/training
You certainly can somewhat cool Argus down for a few days and they’ll probably just go underground vs fight it and keep moving about. I have mine sort of get cooler (basking drops to 100°F) and a few Florida winter nights without much heat. But if you attempt to drop them to 50-60’s (°F) temperatures for months on end as what Lace naturally will "winter" during and go dormant/relaxed, I am not sure Argus are built to survive that as they behaviorally just never stop. Lace will inherently brumate or whatever you want to call it. The Argus like to go go go and never stop. Other species designed/adapted to cool do better - even desert species like Sandies (V. g. flavirufus) know to dig down and rest during cold snaps here with my captives. V. griseus are reported to have prolonged brumation/hibernation periods as well and they are desert and more northern distributed Monitors in the whole range of Monitors as well. The Argus are kind of "dumb" about that and just attempt to keep moving around miserably during cold weather. So I’d be cautious about forcing them to hibernate and relax...... |
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| 06/15/12 04:58pm |
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Daryl- View Profile |
Message To: Krusty In reference to Message Id: 2270128 Monitor intelligence/training
Thanks for that bit of information, but I don’t fully get how it links? Cheers |
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| 06/15/12 05:12pm |
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SalvatorREX View Profile |
Message To: Crocdoc In reference to Message Id: 2270048 Monitor intelligence/training
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| 06/15/12 05:25pm |
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Krusty View Profile |
Message To: Daryl- In reference to Message Id: 2270130 Monitor intelligence/training
If it’s about feeding and getting an Argus to stop dive-bombing at food so aggressively......good luck with that one. LOL That’s the only downside to the species really. Super aggro for food and no way to stop it. Try his feeding tricks that they have to respond to to get fed, but I’m not so optimistic that you can get Argus to follow that one....... |
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| 06/15/12 05:25pm |
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Daryl- View Profile |
Message To: Krusty In reference to Message Id: 2270135 Monitor intelligence/training
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| 06/15/12 06:11pm |
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Krusty View Profile |
Message To: Daryl- In reference to Message Id: 2270143 Monitor intelligence/training
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| 06/15/12 06:33pm |
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Mdf View Profile |
Message To: SalvatorREX In reference to Message Id: 2269904 Monitor intelligence/training
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| 06/16/12 01:28am |
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Crocdoc View Profile |
Message To: Mdf In reference to Message Id: 2270179 Monitor intelligence/training
The important thing to keep in mind here is that the reward isn’t food, but being let out. Lace monitors have the same maniacal feeding response as argus, so teaching them to sit still for food would be really difficult. The ’getting let out’ reward starts as soon as I walk towards the enclosure, because they know what comes next. All I had to do was ignore them when they were acting up but respond immediately when they were sitting quietly, on the correct side of the enclosure, by walking up and letting them out. It only took a few days and they were sitting at the one spot, very quietly. Every now and then they’ll still act up, but when they me suddenly stop walking toward the enclosure, turn away and go do something else they know exactly what to do. It’s an amazing thing to watch them look at me, look around and then head to the correct corner and sit there waiting. |
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| 06/18/12 12:05am |
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Daryl- View Profile |
Message To: Crocdoc In reference to Message Id: 2270371 Monitor intelligence/training
I never thought of the reward stimulus being the ability to be let out of the cage, i always thought regarding monitors, the reward would always be food... apparently not! I know i should not be comparing the two, however, is ’training’ a monitor like a dog? In the way that once older they pick up more habits thus it being a struggle to ’teach’ new things, or are monitors bright enough to be able to get out of habits and learn with age? Thanks Daryl |
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| 06/18/12 12:12pm |
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Crocdoc View Profile |
Message To: Daryl- In reference to Message Id: 2270411 Monitor intelligence/training
Using food as a reward will get you the quickest learning curves, but is fraught with danger with lace monitors because of their strong feeding response. Whenever I’ve taught them to do something, particularly the male, using food as a reward I’ve had to put in a series of intermediate steps between stimulus and reward so he didn’t start biting as he carried out the task. For example, when I taught the male to come to a hand clap or his name being called, I’d never feed him immediately. First I’d put him in the enclosure, then I’d go to get the food (I left it in the kitchen so that there was an extra delay) and then come back to feed him. Consequently, when I called him over to the enclosure he’d first look at the enclosure and try to get in there, because he knew that was the next step. If I fed him immediately after he responded to the hand clap he’d be likely to come running over and bite the clapping hands. It’s how their brain works. Even with the delayed process as I had it he started to shortcut and would start getting edgy as I reached down to pick him up to put him in the enclosure, associating that step with food, so I had to pick him up a certain way to avoid triggering a feeding response. |
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| 06/18/12 07:04pm |
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Dillonh24 View Profile |
Message To: Crocdoc In reference to Message Id: 2270447 Monitor intelligence/training
1. How did you get them so used to being handled and training them to let you pick them up to put them back into the enclosure? 2. From the video it seems that you let them roam a bit outside the enclosure but how did you get them past being defensive when let out of the enclosure? Because as soon as my Savannah got out of her enclosure she turned extremely defensive and that was the first time she had ever hissed at me she was also arched up as to prepare for a tailwhip. |
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| 06/19/12 01:49am |
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Crocdoc View Profile |
Message To: Dillonh24 In reference to Message Id: 2270501 Monitor intelligence/training
I never handle babies. Both of the monitors in these videos arrived at hatchling size (they were older than hatchlings at the time as they’d been held back through underfeeding, but were still very tiny) so I waited until they were a bit bigger, and reasonably bold, before I started any interaction. To start with, interaction consisted of me standing near the open end of the enclosure and putting a gloved hand in for them to approach, smell and, eventually, climb on to out of curiosity. Sometimes, if they were holding still, I’d stroke their chin and then leave them alone. It took a long while. When the male started to climb onto my arm I’d let him out for a short wander and then put him back into the enclosure before things got out of hand. New places/smells can be overwhelming at first and it takes them a while to get used to exploring outside of their known comfort zone. However, once they get used to exploring you’d be amazed at how much of a reward being let out for an exploratory walk can become and they’ll put up with anything just to be able to do that, even being handled. It wasn’t long before they had figured out that being handled to be put back into the enclosure wasn’t a bad thing, for it gave them access to basking heat and food (they only get fed in the enclosure) and they’d get let out again, anyway. Although I said ’they’ in the above paragraph, most of that applied to the male only, who started to become bold between 8 months and a year of age but wasn’t fully calm for a while after that. The female, on the other hand, wanted nothing to do with me for the first four years. The only thing that overcame her fear in the end was hormones - one day, in the middle of a reproductive cycle, she saw the male wandering around on the floor and wanted to be let out to be with him (during the week or so at the peak of a reproductive cycle, the pair mates almost incessantly and can’t stand to be apart). I opened the enclosure and put out my hand, whereby she spent a good few minutes trying to figure out how to get under, over or past my hand to get out and onto the floor with the male. Eventually she looked at my hand and walked onto it and was immediately put onto the floor, where she approached the male and they started mating. The next day when I let the male out she walked onto my hand almost immediately, for she knew the reward would be to be put on the floor with him. As I said, they learn quickly and neither has looked back since. At 12 years of age they’ve both had enough time doing these routines that almost nothing frightens them or makes them defensive any more, as long as it’s associated with me. I’ve even gone into that enclosure with a power drill to make repairs and it didn’t disturb them in the least. |
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| 06/19/12 06:57pm |
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SalvatorREX View Profile |
Message To: Crocdoc In reference to Message Id: 2270579 Monitor intelligence/training
im also doing the left/ right side of the enclosure training. which is. when i open up the left side of the enclosure he gets hyper. and is ready to be fed . because he knows thats the only spot he is fed. the right side of the enclosure is the ONLY side i will let him out of the enclosure! AND in combination with the left side of the enclosure i associated his name (max) with feeding. so he is fed after hearing," come here max", and that trick works with the right side of the enclosure as well , i will say ,"come here max," and he comes expecting food. but when i reach in with a closed fist. he realizes this isnt the side of the cage he gets fed on. and that my fist isnt his feeding tongs. so now he’s calm . and i tricked him into comeing when i called his name.. and since the routine has only just began. he still gets confused as to whats happening but eventually he will know whats going on. depending on what side of the cage i approach.., |
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| 06/19/12 08:19pm |
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Dillonh24 View Profile |
Message To: SalvatorREX In reference to Message Id: 2270588 Monitor intelligence/training
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| 06/19/12 10:54pm |
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