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 #2280891


Juliannajean
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 Please help!!

My frog has been dying from starvation (I tried to force feed him, but he still wouldn’t eat) he is now very thin and I don’t know what to do! Is he suffering, I mean is he in pain? I am not strong enough to euthanize him, I can’t even handle the thought of it,and I cannot take him to a vet...so I really need to know, am I being cruel by letting him slowly die, or am I just causing my own personal suffering?
I know he’s close to dying because he is skinny and you can see his bones...pleas help me, and please don’t berate me, I have done what I’ve done, and maybe I failed, but it does meno good to be put down, believe me, this is hurting me more then you may know.
Thank you



09/20/12  02:58pm

 #2280918


Crotus
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  Message To: Juliannajean   In reference to Message Id: 2280891


 Please help!!

I would not recommend this except as a last resort, but there is a way you can force feed a frog or toad and persuade it to swallow the food. However, it must be done very gently and carefully... First, prepare one or two food items by taking some medium sized crickets and pre-killing them (by pinching their heads or poking them through with a straw -- this is not too gross for you I hope?) Next, hold your frog gently and turn it over belly-up; then gently rub its belly until it seems to fall asleep. Next, now this is the tricky part -- try to get a firm but gentle grip on the frog’s chin using your thumb, while simultaneously holding its snout back, until its mouth slowly opens. Then place one of the dead crickets in is mouth and make sure it is completely inside’ then put the frog down. With some luck it should swallow the prey item... then maybe do the same thing one more time with the 2nd cricket. Do this again once every day or two, but not more often so you don’t stress the frog out, and it should eventually start to fatten up again, and hopefully even show an interest in catching its own food normally. However, you need to check the conditions under which you are keeping your frog. Is the lighting correct? Amphibians do appreciate some full-spectrum fluorescent lighting during to simulate daylight (set on a timer to go on in the morning, off at night) set above the tank. This also allows you to grow leafy plants (like philodendrons etc.) which help make the frogs feel at home). What substrate are you using? To successfully grow some plants, I would recommend a mixture of equal parts garden soil, peat moss and all-purpose sand, moist but but too wet. Under this should be a 1" layer of pebbles for drainage. Also a bowl of clean water should always be available for soaking.
Please try my recommendations and keep me posted. Good luck...



09/20/12  05:45pm

 #2280963


Reptictale92
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  Message To: Crotus   In reference to Message Id: 2280918


 Please help!!

What kind of frog, what set up is it in, and humidity, and temps would be useful information rather then how can I force feed it.



09/21/12  12:21am

 #2280970


Juliannajean
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  Message To: Crotus   In reference to Message Id: 2280918


 Please help!!

Hi, thank you both so much for your replies, they are very much appreciated. I did forget to mention that he also has corneal lipodosis, and I was hand feeding him because he couldn’t really see his food. He’s maybe eaten 2 times in the last 2 - 3 months. (unless he was eating the meal worms I put in there, but I don’t think so) I was pretty sure he was eating the meal worms because he didn’t look so thin, like he is now. Up until a few weeks ago, I didn’t know meal worms turn into beetles! (as if they aren’t ugly enough
)It was pretty strange, at night I kept hearing funny noises and then I noticed holes in the styrofoam mountain climbing wall, I then saw a meal worm coming out of one..I had NO idea they cold do that!

Now to andwer the questions,..I am concerned with force feeing him because he could get even worse because of how long since he ate.c
I know you’re going to think badly of me, but I got him when he was still a little eggas me, but since I have had him for 6 years I haven’t put a light for him, I never checked humidity, or temp.

Should I try again to force feed hw



09/21/12  07:39am

 #2281000


Reptictale92
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  Message To: Juliannajean   In reference to Message Id: 2280970


 Please help!!

Lets hold off force feeding for now. Post some pictures if you can, check the humidity, tempeture and how much/what substrate are you using/have.



09/21/12  11:38am

 #2281035


Crotus
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  Message To: Reptictale92   In reference to Message Id: 2281000


 Please help!!

I am wondering, how did it develop those fatty eye deposits -- did you feed it too many mice? This practice has lately becoming seriously frowned upon in light of the connection with that problem; clearly in the natural environment a frog would eat mainly insects and only very rarely something like a mouse... If the problem is bad enough that it can’t see its food I hate to say this but would have to suggest that you consider euthanizing it; please in the future pay more strict attention to your pet’s dietary and other requirements...
Should you decide on it, here are some expert recommendations for euthanasia in amphibians:
http://www.caudata.org/cc/articles/euthanasia.shtml
Because they have naked, permeable skin like a fish, amphibians can actually be euthanized merely by immersing them in solutions containing certain chemicals, like alcohol or some others, and it is generally considered to be a relatively humane way of doing it.



09/21/12  05:02pm

 #2281081


Juliannajean
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  Message To: Crotus   In reference to Message Id: 2280918


 Please help!!

Hi, thank you both so much for your replies, they are very much appreciated. I did forget to mention that he also has corneal lipodosis, and I was hand feeding him because he couldn’t really see his food. He’s maybe eaten 2 times in the last 2 - 3 months. (unless he was eating the meal worms I put in there, but I don’t think so) I was pretty sure he was eating the meal worms because he didn’t look so thin, like he is now. Up until a few weeks ago, I didn’t know meal worms turn into beetles! (as if they aren’t ugly enough
)It was pretty strange, at night I kept hearing funny noises and then I noticed holes in the styrofoam mountain climbing wall, I then saw a meal worm coming out of one..I had NO idea they cold do that!

Now to andwer the questions,..I am concerned with force feeing him because he could get even worse because of how long since he ate.c
I know you’re going to think badly of me, but I got him when he was still a little eggas me, but since I have had him for 6 years I haven’t put a light for him, I never checked humidity, or temp.

Should I try again to force feed hw



09/22/12  02:27am

 #2281083


Juliannajean
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  Message To: Crotus   In reference to Message Id: 2281035


 Please help!!

I have to ask...why would I feed a tiny Pacific tree frog a mouse? Are you serious; people do that?

As for the corneal lipidososis, I am not 100% sure that is what it is, but it looks very much like what 2 of my other frogs developed and when they became frightened of everything in their surroundings, I had them euthanized; this was just over 2 years ago. At that time, i was told by a reputable person that has extensive experience with frogs, and to quote something he said "The actual disease process isn’t known to date but is believed to be due to being overfed foods that are high in certain fats (and virtually all of the commonly used feeders fall into this category). So, I do understand a bit about fatty foods. My frog was fed mainly crickets and last things he’d been eating were meal worms. He was hand feeding from me, but then he stopped.

I’m not sure what is going on, but he’s really been trying to get out of his habitat in the last few days...so I’m wondering, is he looking fora place to die? Do frogs do that?

Anyway, I appreciate your time, and your replies, but I have to say I am a bit put off from your comment saying "in the future pay more strict attention to your pet’s dietary and other requirements.." I do pay attention to all of my pets dietary needs and other requirements, and I do the best I can and know how. I do not want him to suffer, but for personal reasons, I cannot euthanize him myself. Where I was living when I had the other 2 euthanized, we had a small privately owned pet shop around the corner from me, and they offered to do it. I had a very difficult time with that decision.

If I thought it would help him and it would be somewhat affordable , I would look into a vet visit, but I think he’s too far gone at this point. Believe me, as I think I said before, this is breaking my heart. I’d like to think that though he didn’t get to live in his natural environment, that he’s had a good 4 or 5 years. I know that had I left him in his natural environment, he most likely wouldn’t have lived even close to that long; but I have to question my decision to keep him? I admit, it was a selfish thing to do on my part in many ways,and I have to deal with that. I may be personalizing it too much, but that’s the way I am.

Thank you again for your time and replies,



09/22/12  03:48am

 #2281106


Reptictale92
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  Message To: Juliannajean   In reference to Message Id: 2281083


 Please help!!

I can help if you were to answer my questions an post pics.



09/22/12  11:39am

 #2281271


The Lone Glider
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  Message To: Reptictale92   In reference to Message Id: 2281106


 Please help!!

I don’t know much about tree frogs, But amphibians are insectivores (as you know) and their main Diet is Crickets.. Grasshoppers.. worms(night crawlers) Meal worms are a hard shelled worm and very hard for frogs to eat from what I can tell. I had a Leopard Gecko that a meal worm ate through because since they have a hard shell, alot of the time they go down whole and not eaten and chewed up like crickets which a soft bodied and they can gut load them with healthy things, like potatoes, carrots, apples, pears...ect..ect..ect..They also eat like moths from what I can tell from our grays(wild they don’t actually live with me, they are all around and we observe them) and Fly’s.. I do not question your knowledge on fatty foods, but I do wonder about the cricket thing.. Because they really aren’t that fatty.. One of the best things for amphibians.. and i do not blame you for wanting to keep it nor for not wanting to put it down.. Alot of people tend to judge you if something goes wrong, or if your frog9or other animal) don’t live up to the full however many years people say they live, I had a ferret that died at 4 years of life I fed fresh everything made my own food for the little one played daily with it, and I told some people(on another forum) and they acted like I was the worst person in the world.. But I think we do the best for our animals and sometimes they do die at a young age, but Its ot always because of something we did. I am always here if you need to talk. and any advise.



09/24/12  09:40am

 #2281272


Juliannajean
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  Message To: Reptictale92   In reference to Message Id: 2281106


 Please help!!

I don’t knpw how to post pics on here, and I think it’s too late to save him, he’s so tiny now and he’s weak. His mouth opens every now and then, and he shakes a little. I feel so guilty for letting him suffer.

I can’t figure out how to do picture...can I email to you?



09/24/12  10:14am

 #2281273


Reptictale92
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  Message To: Juliannajean   In reference to Message Id: 2281272


 Please help!!

Its never to late to save an animals life. An yes Email me I also need to know everything. Humidity, Diet, Substrate, Tempature.



09/24/12  10:56am

 #2281282


Crotus
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  Message To: Reptictale92   In reference to Message Id: 2281273


 Please help!!

Hey sorry, I thought you had a large species like a pacman frog or WTF... however, that condition can also sometimes occur, I believe, on an insect diet if a frog is overfed... as you’ve seen, long-term captives can sometimes become very tame to the point of taking food right from your fingers. It can become too easy in such cases to inadvertently overfeed them... I would say with a small type of frog like this, that 6 years is not a bad captive lifespan. I did not mean to upset you with what I said about your keeping conditions, it was just that you yourself admitted that you hadn’t paid much attention to lighting, substrate, etc.



09/24/12  01:24pm


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